Episode 160

How to get featured on Podcasts and Prestigious magazines | Simone Sauter

 Being a coach can be frustrating. You learn to become a coach. You put in the hours of coaching and build up your confidence to start charging for your services, but then you find out you need to have media and marketing strategies, and you need to do sales and loads of other things that aren't coaching, aren't your zone of genius.

Some coaches don't bother and end up falling by the wayside.  Some will find work with coaching companies that will help to find you clients and will give you an hourly rate, and some will want to do things their own way and grow their own coaching business. Or maybe a combination of those options, and this episode is for those of you who really are ready and willing to learn and do what it takes to grow your business.

Podfluence is all about growing your business and your brand to help you get more clients and more opportunities, but we need to know how to find or create these opportunities.

My guest is Simone Sauter, and Simone became a divorce coach after her partner of 10 years, suddenly left her. In that time, she found that one of the best ways to promote her own business and service was by getting featured in prestigious magazines and on podcasts. She figured out how to do that, and did such a great job of it that people started asking her to teach them how to do it too. So now Simone is a publicity coach for professional coaches like you and me.

If you've been wanting to grow your business and your personal brand, but struggling with the how, you are going to get some great tips in this episode and we'll be taking a look at why coaches should be getting featured in magazines and other podcasts, and how to get you started with this and what you need to be doing to grow your business through digital media.

You can download Simone's insider tips giveaway here: https://www.simonesauter.com/insider-tips/

Enjoying the content? Join me for the Podfluence Weekly newsletter on LinkedIn, Medium or Beehive to get articles and show updates every week(ish).

You are warmly invited to join other coaching & speaking professionals who are building their authority through podcasting in the Podfluencers Facebook Group and get your free download of How to grow your list with podcasts.

There are 2 things that fill my heart with joy: one is people sharing my episodes because they've been helpful and hopefully entertaining, and the other is people leaving reviews for Podfluence on Apple Podcasts or PodChaser. Either of these will earn my ever-lasting gratitude and both might just get you on my Christmas card list.

Of course, if you REALLY like the show, you're welcome to support Podfluence financially with our Supercast link Support the show 

Transcript
John Ball:

Being a coach can be frustrating.

John Ball:

You learn to become a coach.

John Ball:

You put in the hours of coaching and build up your confidence to

John Ball:

start charging for your services, but then you find out you need to have

John Ball:

media and marketing strategies, and you need to do sales and loads of

John Ball:

other things that aren't coaching.

John Ball:

Aren't your zone of genius.

John Ball:

Some coaches don't bother and end up falling by the wayside.

John Ball:

Some will find work with coaching companies that will help to find you

John Ball:

clients and will give you an hourly rate, and some will want to do things their own

John Ball:

way and grow their own coaching business.

John Ball:

Or maybe a combination of those options, and this episode is for those of you who

John Ball:

really are ready and willing to learn and do what it takes to grow your business.

John Ball:

This is Podfluence, the show that helps you to grow your

John Ball:

influence and income with podcasts.

John Ball:

My name is John Ball and my mission is to help you, the self-employed

John Ball:

business coach, to grow your influence and income now so you can have a

John Ball:

continually thriving coaching business.

John Ball:

In this episode, I want to take a look at why we should be considering getting

John Ball:

featured in prestigious magazines and on podcasts and how you can make that happen.

John Ball:

Podfluence is all about growing your business and your brand to help you get

John Ball:

more clients and more opportunities.

John Ball:

But we need to know how to find or create these opportunities.

John Ball:

My guest is Simone Sauter, and Simone became a divorce coach after her

John Ball:

partner of 10 years, suddenly left her.

John Ball:

In that time, she found that one of the best ways to promote

John Ball:

her own business and service,

John Ball:

was by getting featured in prestigious magazines and on podcast, she figured

John Ball:

out how to do that, and she did such a great job of it that people started

John Ball:

asking her to teach them how to do it too.

John Ball:

So now Simone is a publicity coach for professional coaches like you and I.

John Ball:

If you've been wanting to grow your business and your personal

John Ball:

brand, but struggling with the how,

John Ball:

you are going to get some great tips in this episode and we'll be taking a look

John Ball:

at why coaches should be getting featured in magazines and on other podcasts,

John Ball:

and how to get you started with this and what you need to be doing to grow

John Ball:

your business through digital media.

John Ball:

Just before we get started, if you are not already following Podfluence and

John Ball:

you have your device in your hand right now, if you are on Apple Podcasts or

John Ball:

Spotify, all you need to do is click the plus button next to the show.

John Ball:

On any other devices or on your desktop, you may see a follow option.

John Ball:

Either of those are good.

John Ball:

You will get the latest episodes of Pod Fluence as they come out.

John Ball:

And if you want more pod fluence, make sure you join me on LinkedIn or beehive

John Ball:

for the Pod Fluence Weekly newsletter and you'll find the link in the show notes.

John Ball:

But now prick up your ears.

John Ball:

Get ready for this week's episode of Podfluence.

John Ball:

Welcome to the show, and we are really all about building influence and building our

John Ball:

authority and getting following, and we have an expert to help us with that today.

John Ball:

So I am joined in the studio by Simone Sauter.

John Ball:

Simone, welcome to the show.

Simone Sauter:

Thank you so much for having me, Johnny.

John Ball:

I'm looking forward to our conversation I know we're

John Ball:

gonna get some interesting bits of information for you and that you

John Ball:

are actually a publicity coach.

John Ball:

This is what you help people with, right?

Simone Sauter:

Exactly.

Simone Sauter:

This is what I help people with getting featured in prestigious

Simone Sauter:

magazines and on podcast shows.

John Ball:

Well, we are in capable hands then today, so this is

John Ball:

gonna, may wanna take notes.

John Ball:

And just so you know, in advance all of the information for everything we talk

John Ball:

about today, any links or anything like that or how to connect with Simone,

John Ball:

it's all gonna be in the show notes.

John Ball:

So if you want to find any of that out, go and check the show notes for the episode.

John Ball:

You'll be able to connect with Simone, you'll be able to get any of

John Ball:

the links to anything we talk about.

John Ball:

And let's get into our conversation today.

John Ball:

when we're talking about publicity and you said about getting people into

John Ball:

prestigious magazines and onto podcasts, why do people generally want to do that?

John Ball:

What are the main reasons that you hear that people want to work with you?

Simone Sauter:

Well, one reason is to get more visible to, reach

Simone Sauter:

an audience on a bigger scale.

Simone Sauter:

Because if you get a featured in the media, right, you can

Simone Sauter:

reach up to millions of people.

Simone Sauter:

Of course, you know, if you're in a, like featured in Cosmo or like big magazines.

Simone Sauter:

But also another reason is to build trust with their ideal client.

Simone Sauter:

And what I see the last year is more and more that trust becomes increasingly

Simone Sauter:

more important because there are so many.

Simone Sauter:

Entrepreneurs out there, and I particularly work with

Simone Sauter:

coaches and consultants, so my clients are the product, right?

Simone Sauter:

So they they help and guide people through some challenge.

Simone Sauter:

It may be in life or in business, it doesn't really matter.

Simone Sauter:

And what the media does is it gives you this credibility instantly, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, subconsciously we know that people who are featured in the

Simone Sauter:

media, they own their stuff.

Simone Sauter:

They know what they do, they are and a trusted expert.

Simone Sauter:

And this is something that is more the goal of coaches that are

Simone Sauter:

like more along the way, like, you know, more six figure coaches.

Simone Sauter:

And if you are more in the beginning and intermediate stages, it's more

Simone Sauter:

like, Hey, I wanna be more visible.

Simone Sauter:

I wanna build my audience fast and get new people into.

John Ball:

Yeah, one of the things that I sometimes find myself talking about and

John Ball:

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this and I was speaking to Chris Ducker

John Ball:

and I dunno if you know who Chris is, but but Chris, I is quite a well known person

John Ball:

in the sort of entrepreneurial space as a speaker, a podcaster and trainer

John Ball:

and does a lot of work with Pat Flynn.

John Ball:

And and one of the things I asked Chris was really about whether some people.

John Ball:

Often starting off with just trying to get the publicity or trying to get

John Ball:

the following and the podcast stuff going and the magazine stuff going.

John Ball:

And that's what they're beginning with.

John Ball:

And they don't have all the foundational stuff that they need do.

John Ball:

Do you sometimes encounter that or do you think it's actually fine to start

John Ball:

working on the publicity straight away?

Simone Sauter:

I actually encourage people to start on their publicity.

Simone Sauter:

Right away.

Simone Sauter:

if they have something like there, there need to be a couple

Simone Sauter:

of things in place, right?

Simone Sauter:

So you need to understand your ideal client.

Simone Sauter:

You need to understand what you want to be known for, because

Simone Sauter:

this is what you talk about.

Simone Sauter:

And you need to have a way to capture people's email addresses because, . Like

Simone Sauter:

I have a lot of people that say like, Hey, I want, I want to promote that

Simone Sauter:

people get on the phone with me, but not everybody who will see you, they, they

Simone Sauter:

are not ready to get on the phone, right?

Simone Sauter:

So you need to create something that people can download

Simone Sauter:

that is very, very valuable.

Simone Sauter:

So that they are willing to exchange their email address for that.

Simone Sauter:

And then you can actually nurture.

Simone Sauter:

and getting in the media and our podcast is actually basically you tap into

Simone Sauter:

already existing audiences, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, I pitched you because I know that we have a similar audience, right?

Simone Sauter:

So now your listeners can listen to me and I am here to share valuable information

Simone Sauter:

that is interesting to your audience.

Simone Sauter:

and if people are interested, they, they can sign up for my email

Simone Sauter:

list and then get into my world.

Simone Sauter:

And from my experience is is a very fast way and a a free way

Simone Sauter:

also to build your audience, right?

Simone Sauter:

So a lot of people also want to start out with ads because they say like, okay,

Simone Sauter:

like social media takes me too long.

Simone Sauter:

I don't know how to do all of that.

Simone Sauter:

Like, but let's do ads.

Simone Sauter:

And ads are great, right?

Simone Sauter:

I love ads.

Simone Sauter:

To really make ads work.

Simone Sauter:

There is a lot of testing involved.

Simone Sauter:

There is money involved, and I see just a lot of people burning their money with

Simone Sauter:

ads, and from my perspective, it's not the ideal way to actually get started.

Simone Sauter:

So, , getting publicity is a great way to get started if you

Simone Sauter:

have a couple things in place.

John Ball:

Yeah, I mean, I think we probably all are very familiar with

John Ball:

the idea of being in magazines for some publicity and being high profile stuff.

John Ball:

Although, I mean, you seem to be that, that is kind of a, a,

John Ball:

sometimes a one and done thing, mate.

John Ball:

You'll be in a magazine, but then you're kind of on the pile and you may be in

John Ball:

a coffee table in a doctor's waiting room or something like that after that.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

. But with podcast.

John Ball:

You are more likely to be perhaps revisited, I think and I know that when

John Ball:

I'm looking at episodes or people's shows, I'm not necessarily looking always for

John Ball:

the most recent episode, and even if I see that, I'm not always gonna listen to it.

John Ball:

I'm looking for the episode titles, not necessarily the guests, but the subject

John Ball:

matter that I'm most interested in.

John Ball:

And sometimes I think people get a bit wrong on that, but what do you advise

John Ball:

your clients with and why do you have a big focus on podcasts particularly?

Simone Sauter:

Like for the same reason I have the focus on podcasts

Simone Sauter:

as well, and I actually don't teach.

Simone Sauter:

Okay.

Simone Sauter:

I always say to my clients, we start online and why?

Simone Sauter:

Because we have, we all have online businesses now I, with my with my

Simone Sauter:

coaching business, with my first business, I've been featured in a lot of like

Simone Sauter:

30 print magazines or something like that, including Cosmopolitan and print

Simone Sauter:

and tv, it doesn't move the needle.

Simone Sauter:

It's great for if you look at building your reputation and your influence, right?

Simone Sauter:

But it's not moving the needle towards building an audience.

Simone Sauter:

What does is getting featured in online magazines.

Simone Sauter:

And on podcast shows, right?

Simone Sauter:

So because you will also rank up Google, you have your topic of

Simone Sauter:

impact and, there are people who look for what you have to share.

Simone Sauter:

And once they Google it, you will appear on the podcast shows you will on the

Simone Sauter:

first page on Google when you have been on prestigious podcast shows and

Simone Sauter:

also in prestigious magazines, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, and it stays there.

Simone Sauter:

And you also.

Simone Sauter:

You build back links to your website.

Simone Sauter:

Now with my first.

Simone Sauter:

I, I used PR for my with my first business just to, to build my

Simone Sauter:

entire business and to grow it.

Simone Sauter:

I have built a website with more than 100,000 monthly organic readers.

Simone Sauter:

And why?

Simone Sauter:

Because I have been featured all over the place and I have done this online

Simone Sauter:

and created all the backlinks and so I am not an SEO expert per se, but the

Simone Sauter:

more backlinks you have from valuable, influential other pages, Like point to

Simone Sauter:

your website that just tells Google, Hey, this is an interesting page and that will

Simone Sauter:

help your ranking for your own website.

Simone Sauter:

Right.

Simone Sauter:

So this is why I teach my clients how to get featured in online

Simone Sauter:

magazines and on podcast shows.

Simone Sauter:

And also I love podcasts.

Simone Sauter:

No, that's

John Ball:

fine.

John Ball:

It's great.

John Ball:

I mean, yeah.

John Ball:

Great that you love podcasts as well.

John Ball:

You were previously a divorce and breakup coach, right?

John Ball:

So this is, this is what you did.

John Ball:

With all of that stuff.

John Ball:

So you know, if there are any divorce breakup, coaches listening in, then

John Ball:

you may want to do exactly what Simone has done to, to replicate

John Ball:

those same kind of results.

John Ball:

But yeah, definitely.

John Ball:

I get that, that being in the sort of high brow or popular

John Ball:

magazines is great for credibility because you can then put on your.

John Ball:

On your information on your media kit as featured in, and

John Ball:

that always looks really good.

John Ball:

But in terms of actually having the lead generation and the people coming

John Ball:

and hopefully knocking on your door at least downloading your giveaway

John Ball:

or joining your community or whatever you asked them to do, podcasts and.

John Ball:

being treated in blog and all those kinds of things have much more chance because

John Ball:

they stay around longer and people are more like to check through, check back

John Ball:

through them, and things like that.

John Ball:

So that's really cool.

John Ball:

What do people need to do to be able to prepare for media with,

John Ball:

particularly with podcasting, like,

Simone Sauter:

Like the, like the process that I teach is it's

Simone Sauter:

basically a six step process, right?

Simone Sauter:

And it's actually fairly simple.

Simone Sauter:

So, as I said earlier, you need to have the foundation, right?

Simone Sauter:

So you need to understand the ideal client so that you know which

Simone Sauter:

kind of show you should pitched.

Simone Sauter:

You need to understand what you want to be known for so that you know

Simone Sauter:

what you, what you talk about, right?

Simone Sauter:

And you should have a lead magnet in place so that you

Simone Sauter:

can actually capture the leads.

Simone Sauter:

The leads, right?

Simone Sauter:

So once you have that, then the next step would be that you create a list of

Simone Sauter:

podcasts that are interesting for you and that actually have your audience.

Simone Sauter:

And what I always say is do not pitch a podcast that you haven't listened

Simone Sauter:

to because it's, this is one of the most common mistakes that I see.

Simone Sauter:

It's like people they send a pitch.

Simone Sauter:

Like it's one pitch.

Simone Sauter:

It's always the same.

Simone Sauter:

Hello.

Simone Sauter:

Hello there.

Simone Sauter:

Sometimes they, enter the name of the podcast host sometimes no.

Simone Sauter:

Yes.

Simone Sauter:

Oh, sometimes.

Simone Sauter:

So one name, which is like, anyway and so now you have the list.

Simone Sauter:

Then you want, what you want to do is you want to go show by show, listen

Simone Sauter:

to the podcast, and then decide what topic, like I always recommend to have

Simone Sauter:

two to four core topics of impact.

Simone Sauter:

Which kind of topic do you want to pitch to that show?

Simone Sauter:

And one part of your research should be.

Simone Sauter:

Has this topic been covered on that podcast already?

Simone Sauter:

If it was like the last six months, I wouldn't pitch them

Simone Sauter:

because they covered it already.

Simone Sauter:

If it was covered two years ago, you can say like, Hey, I've seen two

Simone Sauter:

years ago you covered that topic.

Simone Sauter:

I have actually additional thoughts.

Simone Sauter:

I have a different opinion or whatever.

Simone Sauter:

Like something that you can add to.

Simone Sauter:

Show that already has been published, right?

Simone Sauter:

Yeah.

Simone Sauter:

And then the next step is to write your pitch.

Simone Sauter:

Right.

Simone Sauter:

And with a pitch, it is very crucial and I'm sure you agree on that.

Simone Sauter:

So I, as I said I used to run a po a block with more than 100,000 monthly.

Simone Sauter:

We just still got, I got pitched a lot.

Simone Sauter:

But with a pitch, like, say the name of the podcast host Right?

Simone Sauter:

Spell it correctly.

Simone Sauter:

I can't tell you.

Simone Sauter:

So my name is Simone.

Simone Sauter:

I can't tell you how often I've been Sandra.

Simone Sauter:

So that was like, you know, say the writing,

John Ball:

it's a lack of attention to detail, frankly, as well.

Simone Sauter:

Yeah.

Simone Sauter:

And then spell the name correctly.

Simone Sauter:

And then in the first two sentences, right, relate to the podcast host, right?

Simone Sauter:

Like, show that you listen to the, that you listen to the show, show that

Simone Sauter:

you follow the, the podcast host, and that you actually appreciate the work.

Simone Sauter:

And don't say like, Hey look, this is me.

Simone Sauter:

I wanna be on your show.

Simone Sauter:

Present me to your audience.

Simone Sauter:

This is not what it is about, right?

Simone Sauter:

It's about.

Simone Sauter:

Adding value to the audience of somebody who has built up something

Simone Sauter:

that you want to join in, right?

Simone Sauter:

You want to get into on, on that show and the pod you want the

Simone Sauter:

podcast host to may more or less present it to his of our audience.

Simone Sauter:

Yeah.

Simone Sauter:

So it's up to you to actually add value.

Simone Sauter:

This is what it's all about, and this is something that is really.

Simone Sauter:

that a lot of people do not understand.

Simone Sauter:

I agree.

Simone Sauter:

If it's not about adding value, it is, it is advertising.

Simone Sauter:

Right?

Simone Sauter:

Then you can just do ads.

Simone Sauter:

You're like, you know, if you know how to do this then you know,

Simone Sauter:

you can say like, Hey look, I am the most amazing human being.

Simone Sauter:

I can help you with this and that.

Simone Sauter:

And well also then you have to add value.

Simone Sauter:

But, you know, so this is the, this is.

Simone Sauter:

The most crucial thing you know, relate to the podcast host and then pitch the topic.

Simone Sauter:

Say what the listener will take away, why it is valuable.

Simone Sauter:

Share contact information.

Simone Sauter:

Also, maybe share that you have been on another podcast show before so

Simone Sauter:

that the podcast host can actually listen to you because you know, the

Simone Sauter:

entire podcast show stands and falls.

Simone Sauter:

Quality of the sound how you speak because you need to also speak a

Simone Sauter:

little bit in entertaining because if you talk really like this, this is

Simone Sauter:

not entertaining and nobody wants to listen to that for 30 minutes anyway.

Simone Sauter:

So, , that is basically it, right?

Simone Sauter:

And then if you don't hear back, follow up, follow up in a kind way,

Simone Sauter:

because some people get angry if they don't hear back, like they're,

Simone Sauter:

you know, yeah, I've had that.

Simone Sauter:

We're all busy.

Simone Sauter:

Follow up.

Simone Sauter:

Say like, Hey, always forward the initial pitch so that the podcast

Simone Sauter:

host doesn't have to actually search for your first email.

Simone Sauter:

Make it as easy as possible for the other person.

Simone Sauter:

So like, Hey, I know we're all busy.

Simone Sauter:

, I'm not sure if you have actually seen the the email that I sent you earlier.

Simone Sauter:

I'm looking forward like you can see it below.

Simone Sauter:

Looking forward to hearing back from

John Ball:

you.

John Ball:

Yeah, we think, we think this is all stuff that should make sense,

John Ball:

but it, it's amazing how much it doesn't happen and I, I can tell you.

John Ball:

. It definitely doesn't happen as much as I would like it to.

John Ball:

But you know, I've very much been along the lines of you should definitely

John Ball:

research the shows that you want to go on.

John Ball:

At least listen to an episode or some, at least skim an episode, you know, dip into

John Ball:

it, have a sense of what it's about and the style of the show and the voice of

John Ball:

the host and whether they're funny or not.

John Ball:

Just so you.

John Ball:

What you're getting into.

John Ball:

Are they any good?

John Ball:

As an interviewer, take at least take a look through their list of episodes

John Ball:

and see what they generally talk about and what they're most focused

John Ball:

on and how many episodes they've got.

John Ball:

That's a really important thing to know as well.

John Ball:

How long has the show been going for, you can nearly always see how

John Ball:

long the show's been running for.

John Ball:

And so I've always been like, yeah, you definitely should

John Ball:

check that out and approach.

John Ball:

But I think there are times when it's okay.

John Ball:

In my opinion, it's okay to sometimes do a bit of a sort of spray and pray approach

John Ball:

and copy and paste, like when you're just getting started and you just wanna get on

John Ball:

some shows and you, I don't do this with.

John Ball:

High, that top shows that you really love.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

Definitely give a bit more caring attention to those, but shows that

John Ball:

may be a bit new and things like you can do a bit of a sort of broad

John Ball:

approach with that and just get some experience being a guest on some shows.

John Ball:

And, because I ha I found as a coach as well, that I get better

John Ball:

at talking about what I do.

John Ball:

The more I do it may, maybe you found the same as well and so that's good.

John Ball:

Like you can treat that as, as your practice runs for the bigger shows

John Ball:

that you might like to get onto.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

But at some point you've got to become a bit more intentional about it.

John Ball:

And that's where the sort of strategies that I think you, you are talking about.

John Ball:

Really matter.

John Ball:

Like it's much better, in my opinion, to to get more bang for you about from

John Ball:

being on better quality shows with the right audience than from just being on

John Ball:

as many shows as you can possibly get on that, that agreed to say yes to you.

John Ball:

Yeah, true.

Simone Sauter:

I agree.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

So, so when you're when you're applying to, to be on the show, it's really good

John Ball:

to get a sense of what it's all about.

John Ball:

It's good to have that stuff.

John Ball:

What have you seen that people sometimes get wrong with this as well

John Ball:

or don't do as well as they could do?

Simone Sauter:

Well, also preparing themselves, like, I mean, just

Simone Sauter:

everything that you mentioned, right?

Simone Sauter:

Or also not pitching something that is relevant, right?

Simone Sauter:

Like pitch a business topic to a spiritual podcast or to a health podcast,

Simone Sauter:

or like really just if you do the, the Spain spring and prayer approach,

Simone Sauter:

you at least should have a list.

Simone Sauter:

Podcast that are at least interested in what you have to, to share, right?

Simone Sauter:

Even if you're not relating to the podcast host in the first lines, and

Simone Sauter:

you don't make it like personalized, then you know, make sure that it is

Simone Sauter:

the, at least the right genre, right?

Simone Sauter:

So if you're, if you run a business, you wanna pitch business

Simone Sauter:

podcast and not spiritual podcast or health podcasts or whatever.

Simone Sauter:

And then also like, not preparing themselves good enough for the

Simone Sauter:

actual interview, meaning like, they are super nervous this, and

Simone Sauter:

you can hear it in their voice.

Simone Sauter:

Or I mean, there are strategies you can prepare yourself to be really calm.

Simone Sauter:

And understand if the, if it's like the first show, it's exciting, right?

Simone Sauter:

Like other people will listen to this, but yeah, I think that you should find

Simone Sauter:

a way to, to prepare yourself, right?

Simone Sauter:

So for me it's really listening to music jumping around

Simone Sauter:

because I'm exciting, right?

Simone Sauter:

I'm.

Simone Sauter:

and you know, then I can bring over all the energy.

Simone Sauter:

But some people, when you're really nervous, maybe it's better for you to

Simone Sauter:

actually meditate or to sit down and to breathe and to, to become calmer, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, yeah.

Simone Sauter:

Um, yeah.

Simone Sauter:

But basically you, you said everything that people.

Simone Sauter:

Get wrong,

John Ball:

From a show host perspective that is really important.

John Ball:

And I speak to a lot of other show hosts, like podcasting is a big

John Ball:

community and we speak to each other.

John Ball:

And and one of the things that in a specifically interview based podcasts

John Ball:

will experience is that very often it can take sometimes 30 or 40 minutes for

John Ball:

the guests to get relaxed, enough for the conversation to have a more natural

John Ball:

flow for the rapport to really be there.

John Ball:

And that is where, that's, that's generally where the magic happens,

John Ball:

when things are a bit more relaxed, when people can have fun and open up

John Ball:

and feel connected with each other.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

and, and so sometimes it's a host, you're kind of waiting for that to

John Ball:

happen and, and I have had, I mean, I don't consider myself to be like

John Ball:

a high brow show or a top quality.

John Ball:

Well, I don't think I'm good quality, but you know, I'm not one of the top

John Ball:

podcasters in the world or anything that, as much as I'd love to be.

John Ball:

But I do still get people who come on the show, who have, who are fans of the show,

John Ball:

who apply to be guests on the show and are nervous for coming on the show because

John Ball:

it's something that, you know, that they've listened to and they enjoy the.

John Ball:

That's great.

John Ball:

It's really nice to hear.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, but it's not great when you're trying to interview with them and,

John Ball:

and like, usually they're tense and they're struggling to come up

John Ball:

their answers, they feel a little bit nervous because they, no, it would be

John Ball:

like I, I guess me getting interviewed by Jordan Harbinger or something

John Ball:

like that, I'm gonna be nervous.

John Ball:

I would have to do some of those exercises that you talked about, because

John Ball:

I know that that show's going out to.

John Ball:

Millions of people when that comes out.

John Ball:

And I want to do the best job I can possibly do with that, but if I'm nervous,

John Ball:

I'm not gonna be able to deliver that.

John Ball:

So really important to, to set yourself up as best as you can.

John Ball:

You're, I think, doing like some vocal warmups and things

John Ball:

like that now, that'll help too.

John Ball:

Anything that helps to focus your mind a bit.

Simone Sauter:

Yeah, and I mean, generally I think working on your self-confidence

Simone Sauter:

and trusting yourself is a good thing for your entire business, right?

Simone Sauter:

It's not only when you're a podcast or, or in the media, but also when

Simone Sauter:

you talk to clients, when you get yourself out there on social media.

Simone Sauter:

When you, you know, speak on stage or whatever is really like understand that

Simone Sauter:

you are the expert in what you do and that you don't have to know everything.

Simone Sauter:

This was, for me in the beginning, this was a really big thing.

Simone Sauter:

I always thought like, oh, I'm the expert.

Simone Sauter:

I need to know everything and every little detail and it's not the case.

Simone Sauter:

Right?

Simone Sauter:

So, basically you're an expert when you're two steps ahead of your ideal

Simone Sauter:

client, and if you can share something, that is not common knowledge than you

Simone Sauter:

are an expert in your field, right?

Simone Sauter:

And you will grow with with your career.

Simone Sauter:

I mean, I'm an entrepreneur now for eight years and comparing like Simone

Simone Sauter:

from like eight years ago and Simone from now, there's like, like there

Simone Sauter:

is like worlds in between of that.

Simone Sauter:

Yeah, so I, I think that working on your self-confidence and really owning

Simone Sauter:

your expertise is something that is really valuable for your entire

Simone Sauter:

business and will also help you to be less nervous when you get on podcasts

Simone Sauter:

because you know what you talk about.

Simone Sauter:

You know, that what you can bring to the table.

Simone Sauter:

And honestly, if people ask me something and I can't, I don't know.

Simone Sauter:

I'm just saying, sorry, I don't know.

Simone Sauter:

I, you know, or I take a wild guess or whatever, you know.

John Ball:

Well, I think one of the main reasons that people want to do

John Ball:

this is to build that relationship with the audience, with hopefully with

John Ball:

that perfect future clients even if.

John Ball:

with people who are going to like them or maybe refer 'em to

John Ball:

their perfect future clients.

John Ball:

And you can only really do that if you can create create a level of trust.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, a feeling of trust.

John Ball:

And it doesn't, not trying to say like you trick people in trusting you.

John Ball:

Its more like just giving people that assurance.

John Ball:

And one of the best ways to do that is by being confident in what you talk about.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, it's a human.

John Ball:

To want to put our trust in the people who show the most confidence, even if

John Ball:

they're not their most intelligent people.

John Ball:

Whoever.

John Ball:

Usually people will follow whoever shows the most confidence in a situation.

John Ball:

So now if you, if you were in, in an emergency situation, for example, there

John Ball:

might be someone who is an expert in dealing with emergencies but isn't a

John Ball:

confident person and someone who doesn't really have much of an idea with the

John Ball:

thing, but just says, Hey, go over there.

John Ball:

And, and you are far more likely to go with the person

John Ball:

who's assertive and confident.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

And, and if you just, if you may, it just makes sense in our life.

John Ball:

It also makes sense in the podcasting realm as well.

John Ball:

Like when you're being, I.

John Ball:

, if you can come across with as much confidence as you can muster, then you

John Ball:

are going to have a much easier time.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

Developing those trust relationships.

Simone Sauter:

Absolutely.

Simone Sauter:

And I mean, let, let me share a quick story because I, I think that's a, a

Simone Sauter:

valuable one in regards to building trust and building confidence.

Simone Sauter:

So, because I'm, now, I'm sitting here, I'm relaxed, right?

Simone Sauter:

We have a conversation.

Simone Sauter:

I'm, I'm confident and you know, everything.

Simone Sauter:

Flowy.

Simone Sauter:

It hasn't always been like that.

Simone Sauter:

So, um, I grew into that.

Simone Sauter:

So, when I started my first business I was working as a breakup and divorce

Simone Sauter:

coach, and I, I ran a a program, right?

Simone Sauter:

And in the program there were 35 people and like, so those

Simone Sauter:

people paid me to work with me.

Simone Sauter:

But I also had, I had a Facebook group and I promised them that

Simone Sauter:

there will be Facebook Lives, right?

Simone Sauter:

So I will be there live answering question.

Simone Sauter:

So it was a very tiny audience.

Simone Sauter:

They even paid me because they already wanted, knew they wanted to work with me.

Simone Sauter:

And still, I was so nervous.

Simone Sauter:

I I rented a hotel room so that I have a nice background and I was,

Simone Sauter:

I couldn't sleep the night before.

Simone Sauter:

I was shaking when I got on camera.

Simone Sauter:

And at the end of the day it was perfect, right?

Simone Sauter:

And like the, I could answer all the questions and that was for me the starting

Simone Sauter:

point to build the confidence and.

Simone Sauter:

Look at myself differently and trust myself more.

Simone Sauter:

Right.

Simone Sauter:

. So as you said, the more you do this, the more self-confident you get.

Simone Sauter:

So if you're just in the very beginning, then pitch smaller podcast

Simone Sauter:

shows and get yourself out there.

Simone Sauter:

And but trusting yourself and owning what you do is really is really important

Simone Sauter:

and you grow with it over the years

John Ball:

then definitely, you know, I, my first podcast as a host, I was mostly.

John Ball:

I had to prepare, do a lot of preparation, kind of have semis,

John Ball:

scripted, having, especially with guests, was having questions written

John Ball:

out because it was harder for me to more naturally flow into those questions.

John Ball:

Whereas now I have a bit of an outline of, all right, let's make sure we talk about

John Ball:

this, this, and this, and, and whatever else comes up in the conversation.

John Ball:

And we get a much.

John Ball:

I feel a much more natural conversation by allowing a bit more leeway on

John Ball:

that rather than me just reeling off questions and you just answering them.

John Ball:

I think it's far more interesting to listen to listen to a conversation,

John Ball:

but I do think one of the fears that people have around the podcast side

John Ball:

of things particularly is that they're gonna say the wrong thing or that

John Ball:

they'll mess it up or not say it quite.

John Ball:

and the, the vast majority of podcasts are recorded, and so, okay.

John Ball:

Not every podcaster edits their podcast, but most of the decent podcasters do.

John Ball:

And say, if you are, if you do say something that you think,

John Ball:

oh, I didn't quite say that.

John Ball:

Right.

John Ball:

Can I do that again?

John Ball:

. Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, that should be fine.

John Ball:

And if you really do that the podcaster has to edit that.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

. They're not just gonna, they're not just gonna take that or even if they don't,

John Ball:

I mean, it's still, you know, it is fine to have those mistakes in there.

John Ball:

Nobody expects us to be perfect, and so you nearly always get another go at it.

John Ball:

Or if there's something that goes really wrong, the podcast hosts goal should

John Ball:

be to make their guest look as good as.

John Ball:

because you want the audience thing.

John Ball:

I'm bringing you the best guest, right?

John Ball:

Yeah.

Simone Sauter:

I had a podcast show that had really wrong.

Simone Sauter:

I was the.

Simone Sauter:

, but, so I'm a mom to a one year old and a two year old, and I

Simone Sauter:

was on the show, it was life.

Simone Sauter:

My husband was at home, but I could hear both crying downstairs and screaming.

Simone Sauter:

And I even through my headphones as I went, and they're not home now,

Simone Sauter:

but and I was completely irritated.

Simone Sauter:

I was like, what?

Simone Sauter:

Okay, what, sorry, what?

Simone Sauter:

What did I just say?

Simone Sauter:

And so she actually had to edit the podcast.

Simone Sauter:

And I, you I was really sorry about that, but that happens, right?

Simone Sauter:

And it wasn't a problem.

Simone Sauter:

. But yeah, also, when you say something that you're saying, it didn't come

Simone Sauter:

across quite right, I even say like, okay, sorry, let me rephrase that

Simone Sauter:

so that it's easier to understand.

Simone Sauter:

We, that can happen, right?

Simone Sauter:

You're in the conversation and when you have coffee with some somebody

Simone Sauter:

you also say things and then you look at the other person and you

Simone Sauter:

can see that the person didn't quite understand what you just said.

Simone Sauter:

And it's like, okay, let me rephrase that, and then you just say it again, right?

Simone Sauter:

So yeah I, I completely agree.

John Ball:

Do, do you recommend your clients to listen back to

John Ball:

the interviews that they do?

John Ball:

That

Simone Sauter:

is an interesting question.

Simone Sauter:

I, I actually never got asked that.

Simone Sauter:

I listen back to all the interviews that I've done and I found mostly

Simone Sauter:

that they are better than I've felt.

Simone Sauter:

They were the first.

Simone Sauter:

because we are like, we are always judging ourself.

Simone Sauter:

And sometimes I get off the show and I was like, what is it?

Simone Sauter:

Like, was that, was that, did I say this right?

Simone Sauter:

Was this on point?

Simone Sauter:

Could I say, could I have done this better?

Simone Sauter:

Not always, but sometimes I have a show and I'm like, okay.

Simone Sauter:

And then I listen back to the, to the show and I'm like, oh.

Simone Sauter:

Oh yeah, actually, yeah.

Simone Sauter:

Okay.

Simone Sauter:

Yeah, I said it.

Simone Sauter:

I said it right.

Simone Sauter:

But this also comes with practice, right?

Simone Sauter:

The more you get on shows.

Simone Sauter:

The easier it will be for you to say what you want to say, even though you

Simone Sauter:

sometimes have the impression after the show, like, did I, did I say this right?

Simone Sauter:

So, yeah,

John Ball:

definitely.

John Ball:

No, I think, I think it's pretty helpful as a host.

John Ball:

. I know there are hosts out there who don't listen to their show back.

John Ball:

I, I know that, but I think they should.

John Ball:

I think it's remiss not to if you're, especially if you're a host, because

John Ball:

you should at least be editing it or at least listening to the edited version

John Ball:

and approving it before it goes live.

John Ball:

But I did an interview with a professor and we were talking about

John Ball:

stories, and it is not that long ago.

John Ball:

And the episode's up there for anyone who has listened, but I was really

John Ball:

worried about, . And then when I went and listened back to it I really

John Ball:

just thought that I was, I felt after my depth in the interview, like

John Ball:

he's really super intelligent guy talking about all this really sort

John Ball:

of clever stuff about storytelling.

John Ball:

And it was like, yeah, that's great, . I didn't really, didn't

John Ball:

really have too much to add.

John Ball:

I normally have a lot to add to the conversation.

John Ball:

that time I didn't.

John Ball:

But then when I went and listened back to it, Actually was a lot.

John Ball:

He wasn't nearly as bad as I thought.

John Ball:

And I thought, oh yeah, that's actually great.

John Ball:

We can publish that.

John Ball:

And he definitely looks great.

John Ball:

I'm maybe not shining as much as I would've hoped, but it's fine.

John Ball:

But listening back to my own interviews, I think that's really

John Ball:

important as well, and I do it.

John Ball:

I listen to shows that I go onto as much as possible because I

John Ball:

want to see how I'm showing up.

John Ball:

I want to get a sense of.

John Ball:

And again, it may depend on how the host edits the show, but if you are

John Ball:

doing a lot of umming and ahhing, or if you are if there are things that

John Ball:

you're saying and think, oh, maybe there's a better way to say that I think

John Ball:

it's important to look back and think.

John Ball:

Are you saying anything that's memorable?

John Ball:

Already giving very long-winded answers that that people

John Ball:

are gonna get a bit lost in.

John Ball:

And so you want to have as much of those things as possible, I

John Ball:

think to be a great podcast guest.

John Ball:

If you wanna be remembered, then I have, I sometimes have guests who come on

John Ball:

the show who, , who are, I don't always publish the interviews, but but sense

John Ball:

I give the most long-winded answers.

John Ball:

It's like they, they've come on the show to give a present.

John Ball:

Rather than to have an interview or a conversation.

John Ball:

And it's I get that and that's probably what they've been doing with all the

John Ball:

other podcasts that go out there.

John Ball:

But it's not great to listen to, you know, if I want the TED Talk, I'll go some Ted.

John Ball:

But when I listen to, when I listen to a podcast, do generally want to

John Ball:

hear, yeah, some interview stuff, but some back and forth as well.

John Ball:

I want to hear from the host because I'm not listening to

John Ball:

the show, just for the guest.

John Ball:

I'm listening to the show because I like the host as.

John Ball:

And I think some guests forget that, that the audience are there

John Ball:

for the host, not for the guests.

Simone Sauter:

Yes.

Simone Sauter:

I totally agree.

Simone Sauter:

I absolutely agree.

Simone Sauter:

So, and looking at what you just said and coming back to your question, if

Simone Sauter:

I recommend my clients to listen to that, I would also definitely recommend

Simone Sauter:

them to, to listen to it, to actually, especially in the beginning, you know,

Simone Sauter:

maybe if you like on a lot of podcasts, like further along down the, like the

Simone Sauter:

road and you're more experienced and it's not button super necessary, but in

Simone Sauter:

the beginning when you just start out.

Simone Sauter:

That's probably very helpful for them to actually say like, okay I did great there.

Simone Sauter:

And also to feel okay if it wasn't that great and to ask yourself, okay, what

Simone Sauter:

can I actually improve for the next time?

John Ball:

Yeah, absolutely.

John Ball:

That super important.

John Ball:

You know, I used to do public speaking training.

John Ball:

I still do a little bit here and there, but.

John Ball:

in presentation skills and public speaking training.

John Ball:

It's really important to get people to watch video of themselves back or

John Ball:

to at least hear audio of themselves back because there's stuff you pick

John Ball:

up on that you do that you won't pick up on unless you know, might get the

John Ball:

feedback from someone else, but it's not quite the same as like getting the

John Ball:

feedback and then seeing it for yourself.

John Ball:

And so, so yeah, it's worth having those sorts of reviews and, and checking how

John Ball:

you, how you are appealing to each other.

John Ball:

Do, do you generally recommend your clients to put

John Ball:

together media kits as well?

John Ball:

Because I, I think it's one of those things that's a good thing to have.

John Ball:

Yes,

Simone Sauter:

I do.

Simone Sauter:

And sometimes I do it for them.

Simone Sauter:

So when you.

Simone Sauter:

And it doesn't really matter if it's for the media, if it's for the podcast.

Simone Sauter:

But I find it very helpful to have an overview of one or two pages of the guest,

Simone Sauter:

like, you know, the bio, the core topics of impact, and maybe what is your mission?

Simone Sauter:

Like, what are you up to?

Simone Sauter:

Why, what is your why?

Simone Sauter:

And for Podcast hosts I always recommend a section that, that has

Simone Sauter:

the questions that I would like to be asked because podcast host always

Simone Sauter:

have to think about questions, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, and, and they don't necessarily have to take them, but you can help them.

Simone Sauter:

You can inspire them, or they, you know, they, sometimes they take them one-on-one,

Simone Sauter:

sometimes they don't take them at all.

Simone Sauter:

But for me it's always, and it doesn't matter if it's media or podcast sales,

Simone Sauter:

I always tell my clients it is, if you wanna be successful with podcasting and

Simone Sauter:

getting into the media, it's your job to make their life as easy as possible.

Simone Sauter:

So if you are a pain from the beginning, right?

Simone Sauter:

And you make the podcast, I was ask you a lot of questions

Simone Sauter:

like, can you send me this?

Simone Sauter:

Can you send, and then you sent the wrong thing and there

Simone Sauter:

was a lot of back and forth.

Simone Sauter:

This is like, we are all busy and like, especially the bigger the

Simone Sauter:

show, the more precise everything has to be like in the, I mean, it,

Simone Sauter:

it should be from the beginning, but if you start with very small shows,

Simone Sauter:

it's okay to have this back and forth to learn what is actually needed.

Simone Sauter:

But the bigger the show, the busier the people and then you have to be on point.

Simone Sauter:

And if you put together one or two pages, About yourself and you sent

Simone Sauter:

this as a link, please, not as an attachment because like those are very

Simone Sauter:

big and they just spam the email inbox.

Simone Sauter:

Just upload it to whatever your Google Drive, Dropbox and say like,

Simone Sauter:

Hey, here is my media kit, and then the host can download it or not.

Simone Sauter:

Right?

Simone Sauter:

But that at least you offer something that helps them to

Simone Sauter:

have everything in an overview.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

You know, I, I would say as a host, it's not something that I think you

John Ball:

have to have, but I do generally think when a, when a guest does

John Ball:

have that, it looks a damn site more professional than when they don't.

John Ball:

And I said they, it makes me, shows me that they're really prepared and

John Ball:

that they, as you said, they've made my life easier because I don't have to

John Ball:

do too much effort on, on researching, learn and looking

John Ball:

up and getting the social media links and all that kind of stuff.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, which, which is just very handy.

John Ball:

It's all in one place and you, and, and you can access it and for doing

John Ball:

show notes and stuff like that, which hosts, again, not every host

John Ball:

does them, but for most good hosts do show notes for the show as well.

John Ball:

And, and having a media kid is really going to help with that.

John Ball:

There, there is an important thing we do need to address for people who maybe

John Ball:

haven't done this before and haven't even thought about perhaps applying to

John Ball:

podcasts, but thinking maybe I should do this as a way to get a bit more

John Ball:

publicity, generate some interest, some leads, maybe get some, maybe

John Ball:

you'll get some client bookers from it.

John Ball:

How do you go about finding those shows and then before you even get the pitch

John Ball:

in, then where, where do you look?

Simone Sauter:

Well, there are different strategies, right?

Simone Sauter:

You can, simply Google business podcasts and look for the best

Simone Sauter:

100, and then you can go through.

Simone Sauter:

, you can also, what I highly recommend is like, is there one podcast show that

Simone Sauter:

you really love and that you really know that your ideal client is on there?

Simone Sauter:

Then go to them open, open it in the iTunes store, and then

Simone Sauter:

underneath you can see other shows.

Simone Sauter:

So, or like other shows that people also listen.

Simone Sauter:

Then you can see, okay, what other shows does actually your

Simone Sauter:

ideal client also listen to?

Simone Sauter:

And then you can basically go down the entire rabbitt hole, right?

Simone Sauter:

So, but I always, that's always the strategy that I recommend to start out.

Simone Sauter:

Because like where would you start otherwise, right.

Simone Sauter:

So most of the people come to me say, okay, I really love this podcast.

Simone Sauter:

I really would love to be featured on that one.

Simone Sauter:

And typically they are bigger ones, right?

Simone Sauter:

So not the ones that you sought.

Simone Sauter:

. And it's a good place to start with this strategy because there you find also

Simone Sauter:

the smaller ones, the medium sized ones, and also the really big ones, right?

Simone Sauter:

So the ones that you really only pitch when you have more experience,

Simone Sauter:

when you also grow your business a little bit and then you're

Simone Sauter:

not, when you're not a beginner.

John Ball:

Yeah, absolutely.

John Ball:

And I, I tended mostly to use to use the podcast matching apps and, and groups.

John Ball:

For this.

John Ball:

So, you know, one of the, one of the best ones that I've used and, and I've

John Ball:

had the creator on the show before is PodMatch as a Alex Sanfilippo at PodMatch.

John Ball:

And I find, you know, as, as a host who wants expert guests and wants

John Ball:

people to really have a, a clue about what they're doing, that is.

John Ball:

. That tends to be one of the places where I get connected

John Ball:

with a lot of my best guests.

John Ball:

But sometimes I uh, you know, some, some of the best applications I get are

John Ball:

people who've actually found my show.

John Ball:

Much like what you're saying.

John Ball:

They've checked out, they've checked through some things, or maybe they've

John Ball:

even been recommended to the show or maybe they've listened to other similar kinds of

John Ball:

shows or been on similar shows and they've actually been looking for the shows that

John Ball:

are talking about those kinds of topics because things like the genres that shows

John Ball:

generally get listed in are very, and so it could still be hard to find the kinds

John Ball:

of shows that are suited to you because I don't think there's, I don't think there's

John Ball:

too much point in going on many shows that

John Ball:

aren't targeting the kind or at least likely to have the

John Ball:

kinds of people that you want to connect with in their audience.

John Ball:

Sometimes it can be like I, I don't think there's any harming

John Ball:

going on some shows that are just for, for you to have some fun.

John Ball:

But again, you do.

John Ball:

I think you do have to think about your professional image.

John Ball:

You do have to think about it.

John Ball:

Does that fit with what you have been projecting to other shows

John Ball:

and to, as, as who you are.

John Ball:

So you can't be too self-indulgent.

John Ball:

I, I got, I talk mentioned a few times, I've got invited to go on a show where

John Ball:

people talk about a time that they broke the law and I'm thinking, Okay.

John Ball:

I could see that that could actually be an interesting conversation and

John Ball:

I, I would love to, it'd be fun, but it really doesn't fit with what I'm

John Ball:

about or, or what, what I'm doing, sir, or what I'm doing professionally.

John Ball:

So I think it would be very indulgent to go on that show and could actually

John Ball:

be a little bit damaging to my brand.

John Ball:

I mean, I don't know that it would be, I don't know that.

John Ball:

Okay.

John Ball:

But in terms of thinking, well, am I gonna be getting value from my time?

John Ball:

It's like you do have to.

John Ball:

Is that the right kind of show for you to go on?

John Ball:

Are you gonna be getting the kinds of leads that you want to get to?

John Ball:

Nothing wrong with going on podcasts for fun, that's absolutely fine.

John Ball:

But your brand is a part of this too.

John Ball:

And so you do have to project a brand image out there as well and make sure

John Ball:

you're clear on what that is, right?

Simone Sauter:

Yeah, exactly.

Simone Sauter:

That's what I said in the beginning.

Simone Sauter:

You need to understand what you want to be known for, and part of that is

Simone Sauter:

also that you appear on podcast shows

Simone Sauter:

that actually cover what you talk about, right?

Simone Sauter:

I mean, I can easily go on other podcast shows and talk about how to survive

Simone Sauter:

divorce easier, what you need to, you know, think about and like legal

Simone Sauter:

stuff and all these kind of things.

Simone Sauter:

But this is not, I don't run this business anymore.

Simone Sauter:

I used to do this of course, because podcast was also a big part of that.

Simone Sauter:

And I sometimes still get approached for that topic, but I'm, you know, I'm

Simone Sauter:

still like, okay, you know, I grow my PR business, I help other people with pr.

Simone Sauter:

I don't do the divorce and breakup thing anymore.

Simone Sauter:

And for that reason, I don't go on podcasts.

Simone Sauter:

And talk about that because then people will find me.

Simone Sauter:

And then, I mean, I had a lot of success with, with my first business and because

Simone Sauter:

I also shared my personal story there because my ex left me after 10 years

Simone Sauter:

relationship completely out of the blue.

Simone Sauter:

Shared my story and that, you know, connected with people and then they

Simone Sauter:

connect with me and then I have to tell them, Hey, look, I don't run this

Simone Sauter:

business anymore, but if you are in need of pr, you know, I can help you.

Simone Sauter:

And like that, it just doesn't fit.

Simone Sauter:

And, and I mean, get it going on a podcast, which is about

Simone Sauter:

a time when you broke the law.

Simone Sauter:

, well, you know, could be fun, could be damaging.

Simone Sauter:

You never know, right?

Simone Sauter:

So . Yeah.

John Ball:

Right.

John Ball:

So I mean, why, why, why take the risk in that sense?

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

And yeah, the same as like, no, I, I wouldn't, like the same reason I wouldn't

John Ball:

have guests who, I don't particularly.

John Ball:

If, I don't think, if I think somebody's kind of practicing

John Ball:

unethically or, or a bit of a, a sort of charlatan in the space, I'm

John Ball:

not gonna bring them onto my show.

John Ball:

And I'm not gonna name names here, but you know, I, I have been approached

John Ball:

by some of those people before to, to be guests on my show, nor

John Ball:

would I want to be on their shows.

John Ball:

I actually don't want the association at all with people who I just don't feel.

John Ball:

Now the thing about.

John Ball:

It matters who you were such shit with.

John Ball:

It matters who you're connected with.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

And I know some people will maybe do that for the, for the controversy, for

John Ball:

the clicks and, and for sort of rattling people as well, but I don't generally

John Ball:

think that that works as a, as strategies or being contrarian or controversial.

Simone Sauter:

That all reflects to your brand.

Simone Sauter:

Like sometimes it works, right?

Simone Sauter:

Sometimes you know, one, one strategy that I teach my clients to pitch

Simone Sauter:

the media actually is about having a controversial opinion saying, Why

Simone Sauter:

everybody should suffer from hard at least once in their lifetime.

Simone Sauter:

What was one topic that I pitched a lot, A lot got picked up a lot because

Simone Sauter:

it's controversial and you have to read it twice, but you always have to

Simone Sauter:

understand and think about, okay, what, like how does it reflect on my brand?

Simone Sauter:

How does it present my brand?

Simone Sauter:

And, and do you actually want that?

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

I think you have to, I think it's good to have some strong opinions, but it's,

John Ball:

it's interesting that I've been seeing somebody recently who I, who I really like

John Ball:

and, and admire, but he, he does these, some of these kind of rants and sometimes

John Ball:

I think they're a little bit mean.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, but I, I kind of, there's part of me that really respects that

John Ball:

he takes a really strong stance.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

an opinion on that.

John Ball:

And I think, yeah, people are going to see that.

John Ball:

But there's another part of me that thinks, I dunno if I would want to work

John Ball:

with him because he comes, he comes off, it comes off arrogant and I don't know if

John Ball:

he knows that it comes off as arrogant.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

and, uh, so there's, there's all that kind of thing.

John Ball:

I think some strong opinions are good, but certainly not close

John Ball:

mindedness, but not being contrarian for the sake of it, or controversial.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

Just just for like click for the clicks.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

. Yeah, exactly.

John Ball:

So, you know, some good strong opinions, some notes, some

John Ball:

things that ruffle may ruffle.

John Ball:

A few feathers are great, so long as they are actually your opinion.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

and hold truth to them.

John Ball:

But, you know, people worry a lot about being canceled and stuff like that.

John Ball:

I think it's a lot less likely than people.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

really imagine.

John Ball:

But you know, it's about authenticity.

John Ball:

It's about being true to yourself.

John Ball:

And I think that's, that's one important stuff.

John Ball:

, are there any other things that you think really help people in terms of

John Ball:

maybe standing out as podcast guests?

John Ball:

I, we talked about sort of not being mumbly or monotone and things like

John Ball:

that, but what, what do you think really helps people to stand out?

Simone Sauter:

Well, to stand out?

Simone Sauter:

Is it, uh, like for, for the, like in terms of the podcast host

Simone Sauter:

is really like, uh, relate to the podcast host, build rapport.

Simone Sauter:

Say their name, right and that you appreciate the, the show.

Simone Sauter:

Offer them a media kit or podcast kit, how I call it and make

Simone Sauter:

their life as easy as possible.

Simone Sauter:

And as a guest.

Simone Sauter:

Like be, you know, be authentic.

Simone Sauter:

Like, like be easy to talk to.

Simone Sauter:

And also, uh, Have a standpoint, right?

Simone Sauter:

And, and at bonus points, if you have a, a framework, which I have, but we

Simone Sauter:

didn't talk about this in particular.

Simone Sauter:

But if you have a framework that you can actually present to an audience

Simone Sauter:

and say like, okay, this, these are the steps that people have to take, then

Simone Sauter:

you know, that's that is great as well.

John Ball:

and, you know, yeah.

John Ball:

Like your six point process that you mentioned earlier, that kind of thing.

Simone Sauter:

Well, we talked about the first, first four steps, so, but,

Simone Sauter:

you know, so it's but, but it's also easy because then you can you can also

Simone Sauter:

outline the value that the listener has say like, Hey, this is what I do.

Simone Sauter:

This is actually my framework or my process, my method,

Simone Sauter:

however you wanna call it.

Simone Sauter:

And then you also, you know, have a little bit that, that.

Simone Sauter:

The steps, and then you can put the flesh around it as it goes in the conversation.

Simone Sauter:

So now we covered the first four.

Simone Sauter:

Of my process, and it was a great conversation.

Simone Sauter:

Right?

Simone Sauter:

So, yeah that's what I, what I typically recommend.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

Yeah.

John Ball:

I would definitely recommend as a host leaving a review for the podcast as well.

John Ball:

Mm-hmm.

John Ball:

, and let them know that you've left it because reciprocity

John Ball:

is a very powerful thing.

John Ball:

Hmm.

John Ball:

But of course, no, leave them a nice review.

John Ball:

If you want to be on the show, that's gonna, that's gonna

John Ball:

make the bigger difference.

John Ball:

It doesn't, A lot of people think that reviews help podcasts grow.

John Ball:

They, they don't, but they do give more credibility.

John Ball:

They do give that trust factor as well.

John Ball:

So it's very helpful to podcast hosts.

John Ball:

And it's also a bit of, bit of ego massage for us as well.

John Ball:

And none of us object to it.

John Ball:

None of us object to that.

John Ball:

You, you do have a, a giveaway, an ebook that people can check out.

John Ball:

Can you tell us a little bit about

Simone Sauter:

that?

Simone Sauter:

Yes.

Simone Sauter:

So I have an ebook with 10 insider tips on how to get publicity if

Simone Sauter:

we are coaching our consulting.

Simone Sauter:

and it's basically you know, 10 things that people generally don't

Simone Sauter:

know about media and podcast shows.

Simone Sauter:

Some we covered, some we didn't yet.

Simone Sauter:

It's very valuable as I think it's 18 pages.

Simone Sauter:

And I basically gave away what I learned the last 20 plus years.

Simone Sauter:

That's the time that I'm in the PR and media industry.

Simone Sauter:

and yeah, if you wanna download it, you can find it on

Simone Sauter:

simonesauter.com/insider tips.

John Ball:

Yep.

John Ball:

So links will be in the show notes for you to go and download your copy of that.

John Ball:

I know I'm gonna be getting my version of that as well, because I want to

John Ball:

know how to improve my publicity if there's one thing you hope that

John Ball:

people remember the most or take away from this particular conversation,

John Ball:

what do you hope that that would be?

Simone Sauter:

That they need, that they, it's their job to make

Simone Sauter:

the life as easy as possible.

Simone Sauter:

The life of the

Simone Sauter:

podcast host and also the journalist if you pitch to media.

Simone Sauter:

. That is basically your job.

Simone Sauter:

If you

Simone Sauter:

make, if you do this, and if you show that you if you take your efforts and

Simone Sauter:

then if you show that you really want to support the podcast host or the

Simone Sauter:

journalist I think you really stand out because a lot of people don't do that.

Simone Sauter:

And also work on your self-confidence.

Simone Sauter:

It'll help you in your business generally.

John Ball:

Simone, it is been a wonderful conversation.

John Ball:

I've learned a lot from you.

John Ball:

I know I'm gonna be going as soon as we finished speaking, going

John Ball:

and downloading your ebook on how to get multiple publicity.

John Ball:

But I just wanna say a big thank you for coming and being on the show.

John Ball:

It's been wonderful speaking to you.

John Ball:

Thanks so much

Simone Sauter:

for having me, and I love the conversation.

John Ball:

So now you know why you should be getting featured in

John Ball:

prestigious magazines and on podcasts, and we've given you some how to.

John Ball:

We covered some strategy for finding the places to be featured and what you

John Ball:

need to make sure you have ready to go before you do and a few bits more, you

John Ball:

can get some more great information from Simone with her 10 insider tips

John Ball:

to get publicity for your business and some other great information by

John Ball:

following the link in the show notes.

John Ball:

And of course if you want to get more Podfluence, then join me and hundreds

John Ball:

of others for the Podfluence Weekly newsletter so you can get additional

John Ball:

insights and articles on growing your coaching business for the long term.

John Ball:

All you have to do is join me on LinkedIn or beehive from

John Ball:

the link in the show notes.

John Ball:

Next episode is just gonna be me of my myself.

John Ball:

But I'm gonna be bringing you another expert interview very soon.

John Ball:

I will share this with you.

John Ball:

I have been having some conversations with some very top level people in the

John Ball:

world of podcasting, and the majority of them are agreeing to come and speak

John Ball:

to us at Podfluence so you can be sure that you are gonna be getting the very

John Ball:

best information for how to be using podcasts and growing your business

John Ball:

to get the best results by making sure you are subscribed to Podfluence.

John Ball:

Wherever you're going, whatever you are doing, have an amazing rest of your day.

About the Podcast

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Podfluence
The podcast that helps business coaches build influence and income with podcasts

About your host

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John Ball

From British Airways flight attendant to global online business coach & trainer with Harv Eker to podcaster and persuasion expert, it's been quite the journey for Johnny Ball. Now the author of the book Podfluence: how to build professional authority with podcasts, and host of the Podfluence podcast (formerly Speaking Influence) with over 150 episodes and over 10,000 downloads Johnny is now focused on helping business coaches and speakers to build a following and grow your lead flow and charisma at the same time with podcasts.